All three of the squad get together for a brief catch and up and round off the fairly insane developments over recent weeks’ across LIV and the PGA tour. Elevated events, PIP driven pool of players, a barnstormer of a finish in Boston which seemed to pass without much fanfare and more…
Your Content Goes Herehello and welcome back to another episode of the cookie jargo podcast I am
Tom Bales and today I’m joined by Bruce Fitzpatrick good day or good
evening and Sir Sam Williams have a gentlemen Asia since we’ve potted
together absolutely bloody ages yeah it has been it has been a while well we
were going to get together weren’t we last week and do a little podcast but uh your house moved Tom and by the way if
you want to hear more about Tom’s house move spoiler alert for the church Stratton course Diaries podcast coming
up very soon um but obviously sandwiched between raw North Devon and you going to Spain as
well Bruce it’s been a little bit hectic on the golfing front since season is here we’ve been getting out playing a
bit it’s a wonderful time of year to play golf isn’t it as the sort of I mean it’ll be strictly an awesome probably summer I guess or something but yeah
we’re edging into water it certainly feels like Autumn busy period um how is Spain Spain was very good fun
thanks um yeah played a little bit of golf uh in the south of Spain so that was that was uh enjoyable we need to do a course
Diaries podcast which will be inbound shortly on um Royal North Devon of course we don’t want to overlook that
the Cradle of English golf much to dissect and discuss there yeah very good
and I did spot you posted a little picture of yourself in Spain Bruce and then the DMS were a light and obviously
I’m Man mark in the social media asking me was it last precess I had absolutely no idea so I just ignored the messages
yeah that was the course played on um on Saturday yeah
team what’s it like oh um which hole is in Rob McGovern
that’s a really good question no definitely wasn’t the 18th I’ll tell you right now it might be the 12th
okay it’s just got it to handle you know he just pull it up he’s just he’s such a consummate professional with all these
things he’s like I tell you now no problem at all well the great thing is you know I I put them in the I put them
in the chat in the in the episode notes it’s the eighth I thought it was around seven or eight it’s the eight yeah
risk and reward part five classic sort of heroic goal fall with water in front of the green much like the 12th there I
think I think there is actually something to be said about um golf in the Mediterranean region because
I mean friend of the Pod Malcolm duck called it sort of gin and Tony yeah and
I think you know by and large um yeah I I don’t know if that really
captures it I think there’s a lot of heroic Golf out there there’s quite you know you know how um
sad and obsessive Harry and I can be about you know playing off back tees and playing with slope rating and seeing you
know how difficult the courses are out there and actually Bruce
the courses out there um are yeah very very highly rated on on
slope because there is just so much water and there’s so much architecture in the kind of mold of heroic golf
really um I don’t know it’s the for me personally I don’t think many of the
courses out there um have the same kind of charm and an architectural appeal as a lot of courses
in in the United Kingdom but that’s not to say they’re not great and good fun to
play on their own Merit I just think that yeah there’s there’s Maybe
less variety um yeah in Spain in Spanish and Portuguese
golf but I would be happy to be proven wrong there if anyone’s got any recommendations of some some Great Courses to go and play
um we’re fortunate enough to play for a couple of days at valarama which I think is is a really quite unique course
um that’s probably quite different to you know the mold that I mentioned just there because that is
um much more sort of tree line it was the obviously the infamous Court trees
small greens um not an overabundance of water there makes it uh makes it slightly different
but yeah I think I mean you’ve played a little bit of gold fan in Portugal haven’t you Sam and Tommy if you you’ve
played there too I’ve seen you remember yeah I’d agree it’s a little bit a little bit kind of similar similar brand throughout isn’t it I mean there’ll be
some little the problem is you tend to fly into these big big kind of resorts destinations don’t you so that’s where
they tend to stick the you know the kind of more you know newly built courses water solder and like you say a little
bit longer Championship tests I dare say if you really went off the Beaten Track in Spain and you know I’d love to get
out and play padrino I’d love to go and see some of the some of the Charming places that sit up in the hillsides and stuff because they’ve got to be there in
abundance but anyway that’s not the reason we’re here gentlemen no we want to do a little recap on the on the
goings on the World of Golf law Lord knows there’s plenty of it at the moment I don’t even know how we start to to uh
to kind of get our way through this but it feels like so much there’s obviously the whole thing around live we’ve just
come off the back of the DJs inaugural live Victory
um which you know I to be honest with you I don’t think they could have they
couldn’t have bought a better um finale to to the event if they’d tried and it seemed to pass without kind
of too much note I don’t know if you noticed but you know DJ winning with an eagle on the first playoff hole was just
um absolutely I mean it’s it’s arguably great TV if that was if that was PGA Tour that would have been that would
have been one of the highlights of the season it’s actually kind of passed through that too much Affair have you noticed yeah and this is definitely a
theme we need to um pick up on and maybe it’s not worth going down the rabbit hole now but it seems like
um mainstream golf media Outlets have made a stand in terms of not particularly on on you know the usual
suspects in terms of social media channels Instagram Twitter Facebook they’re not giving it anywhere near as
much oxygen as they used to it’s like no no you know one little post DJs one four
and a half million and that’s it um it’s remarkable isn’t it the thing is
it is the biggest story in the game right now there’s no getting away from it you know and live the developments in the PGA
Tour it’s the biggest story it’s almost like it’s become like an embargo topic have you noticed yeah
and that hardened Twitter verse that just you know I wouldn’t watch I
wouldn’t watch live if you know if my life depended on it and it’s just it’s so people are so worked up on
you know the source of the funds and whether or not it’s ethical to watch it and if the players are sold out but the
I think the mainstream media have died off a little bit in terms of how
aggressive they’ve been towards it although you’ve got a few that are still really trying to Bang the Drum against
it and then you’ve got a whole bunch of people that are I think as it progresses I mean it doesn’t
appear like it’s getting tons of views like the views on the YouTube live aren’t phenomenal but like I don’t
really know how how that compares to the PGA Tour 17 000 views it’s not that it’s not phenomenal
it’s abject I mean like just by any measure that’s just terrible really 70
000 views on YouTube I mean I I don’t I’m not digging watching it I haven’t been watching it I’ve been like you know
edge of the seat and stuff and I don’t know why it’s not because the tournament because of the
tournaments not because I have any particular views against it um there is some sort of atmosphere when
Matt wolf slam dunked is is the t-shirt on the part three and had you know they’re all howling like wolves it was
all a bit you know bizarre there is actually some atmosphere but like I’m
I just I cannot explain why but I just can’t watch it
for more than 20 minutes without being yeah no I totally agree that’s that’s the weirdest thing with this isn’t it you know I’ve I’ve kind of criticized
the first couple of events because it has just been like exhibition golf it’s like there’s nothing to see you’re watching them
kind of meandered around for three rounds I think the broadcast is like littered with this sort of backslapping
culture about you know welcome to live you know as soon as someone hits it within 10 feet of the flag which is a
bit nauseating but the tournaments haven’t delivered you could argue though last weekend it
really did deliver and it was a great tournament but like you say no one really got up for it it’s it’s a really
strange one but obviously that’s coming off the back of a huge amount of player announcements yeah you know I think
that’s worth us talking through in a little bit you know obviously the players that came across I think you
know maybe some of the some of the ones that didn’t come yeah so let’s kind of walk it back so let’s walk it back to I
think we’ve not really covered it in great detail since the 150th open um that concluded on the 17th of July I
think it’s fair to say we were aware on the ground that there were murmurings and indeed it was brought up in cam
Smith post Championship presser that he was going to go to live the following day yeah which he obviously didn’t and
then that was subsequently amended to say well there’s murmurings that he wants to play in the FedEx Cup playoffs
he might want to play Presidents Cup a lot of speculation but it felt like the
150th open was a bit of a turning point because you had Martin Slumbers Chief eject to the RNA coming out and giving
quite a um sort of well-articulated passionate defense of
the sort of status quo along with tiger as well who for ages had remained pretty quiet on the
topic but gave probably his longest um and most considered
um the announcement of the of Live And The Format what it stood for
what it meant for younger players and since then it’s just kind of picked up pace really it felt like the 150th open
was like you know um the Battle Cry really in it and since then it’s just gotten more and more
um acrimonious between the two sides yeah and like the PGA Tour just just kind of you know reflecting on the last
few weeks of almost you know rather than do anything to build Bridges towards because what you’ve what you’ve now got
this situation is where the international players are fleeing on mass heading out to go and play this you
know kind of a you know strip backs um kind of series of commitments different
events going into live right it’s not really that attractive to the
vast majority of the PGA players okay you’ve got people like Patrick reader going et cetera but you know by and large it’s more attractive to
International um golfers and then you’ve got the PGA Tour that seems to have gone the
opposite direction and basically just going yeah I’m going to double down on this I’m going to make this almost an exclusively PGA Tour
um kind of us brand um they’ve done everything they can I would say to not kind of play to the the
stuff that they were looking at Beyond kind of increasing purses you know all the other elevated events you know
monaghan’s come out and said don’t think the Scottish is he’s basically refused to confirm whether Scottish will be one
of those elevated events it kind of looks like it’s just going to be used to alternate across it if I don’t know how
to come out and confirm the Scottish I thought the Scottish I think he said it’ll alternate so I think you know
there’s obviously this commitment to is it 20 elevated purses throughout the
year sit or 12 elevated but that was interesting in and of itself oh did you
hear John Ram’s comments on this you know so Rahm was like spitting
feathers about it because he found out during an interview with him as he was like an oppressor and they were like oh
so you got to play 20 events and you’ve committed to that and he was
like well I haven’t committed to it and I got to like yeah you’ve got to it’s the whatever it works out as the four
majors the players and of course you know the whatever
but then obviously the Europeans that are still on um from a PGA Tour like Rory Ram
Fitzpatrick hovland um hat and low allowry
they’ve still got to play a certain amount of the DP World Tour
to qualify for the Ryder Cup so they will certainly have a
an uh fixture list which is like almost it’s never going to save the
money it’s not gonna I don’t think any of this is going to actually result in significantly less gold for these
players no he wasn’t talking about it saving them many golf but he was like I can’t physically commit to that many because because I’ve got to I’ve got to
go and play the DP World Tour as well because I’ve got to get my Ryder Cup status so he was suggesting that something or
basically suggesting you need to go out to Rory because Rory will give you the answer but when the DB World Tour qualification process
um will have to change so they don’t have to go qualify in Europe with the DP World Tour or
whether they won’t have to commit to the 20 events in the PGA but it obviously it’s all so fresh like they just come
from you know 90 Wing in it really well yeah I think the the the DP Ryder Cup
requirement that that needs to be that’ll be ironed out um
later I I feel you know the the 20 event minimum is the story here because for
many years or you know the the 15 um tournament requirement on the PGA
tour was the sort of yardstick as it were and and whenever Liv came along and said well we’re only going to require
our players to play in 14 that was the refrain of the Defenders of the PGA Tours well it was only a 15 event
requirement that’s now been boosted to 20 but you have this weird sort of bifurcation almost with 12 of those
20 events being elevated events and that’s Century tournament champions the
Genesis Arnold Palmer there’s WGC Bell Max play I think the memorials won
um the BMW TOUR Championship again I mean that’s just sort of by the by there’s not really much to change there
in essence they’re just kind of formalizing the the events which people
already consider to be the most important are in fact going to be the most important and compensated that way financially but this requirement that
they’re going to get the top players together at those events is is the key difference I think because they’re
saying that
so I mean this is this is the strange thing with this it has become you know there’s always been this discussion the
PGA Tour is meritocratic you know you you get into a field on a Monday through through Q school or whatever you kind of
you turn up to Monday qualify you can find yourself in the event on Thursday you make the cut you can go home with
some money now these elevated events are going to be closed off they’re going to be really ring fence to the elite players
those elite players are going to be determined by media mentions Google search all those kind of things you know
how much they resonate with the fan base so all the ones that aren’t within that elevated kind of you know aren’t
elevated events as such where they’re playing for 20 million dollars stuff like the Shriners whatever they’re going
to be you know I hate to say it but they’re also run events they kind of are already like you know which events are
going to be worth tuning in for but it’s it’s a really strange one you’ve almost prohibited a large number of players
there from playing in any of these elevated events um sorry you’re the PIP thing just to
clarify though I I’m not sure the players are getting into these
events on the basis of pip rankings I think so 20 20. yeah so 20 20 spots will be
ring fence for this sort of elevated Series where they will be essentially mandated to play in 13 of
the elevated events and three others that they’re choosing um because for someone like Fowler he’s
the example of someone who engages quite highly on the pit but because he’s ranked outside the top 100 in the world
question marks as to whether he’d only get into those events for which he is actually eligible based on world ranking
yeah that’s correct
because I think the facts are out there people can go out and find them you know if they want to find them what do you
think about all this what do you think about um the fact that the PGA Tour and Jay
Monaghan has reacted the way that he has do you think it’s the right thing to do
do you think you just basically knee-jerking the whole thing or do you um what do you think
well I think it’s had to happen but you’ve summed it up bedtime like it’s reactive it’s totally reactive and
doesn’t seem particularly fresh or original
um who knows I mean time will tell as to whether it’s a you know their positive changes
but um yeah no one no one could be you know saying the PGA PJ tour should be winning
prizes for originality and creative thinking the the greatest kind of um
signal to me is that all those stories about why the PGA Tour couldn’t
expand and increase prize funds and increase some of the incentives and
um you know stuff like the PIP for example all that just seems to be complete
bollocks because they’ve done it overnight you know and I think that’s the real concern they just they just found it they’ve literally just found it
as soon as there was a threat and I the idea that all that money is just locked out again I mean until live golf came
along doesn’t seem to me to be a particularly satisfactory answer so um I mean that’s the story I think needs
to be told it’s like why is it that Jay Monahan’s been raking in somewhere between seven and 14 million dollars for
the last I don’t know five years or since he’s been commissioner that’s you know widely estimated to be I mean in fact
some of it’s publicly available information so it’s not it’s not estimated it’s fact but in and around you know the range of seven million
dollars to 14 million dollars is probably the most highly um
paid commissioner in American Sports based on the actual Revenue which the PGA Tour generates I mean he he kind of
outweighs uh NBA and um NFL MLB
equivalent I’d love to see the statistics I bet you Jay Monahan earns more than the average PGA wage
yeah yeah 100 yeah I mean I mean what’s the average take home on PGA Tour for
your average carded player would be sub three million dollars would be my guess but that’s not all the story is it because again he’s creating value for
all the players so I don’t think is he creating value no that’s the argument isn’t it like I don’t think I don’t think he has been adding value I mean
I’d like I wonder what sort of I’d be really interested to just see how that whole conversation had flowed seeing
these lit events that live unfold and just then seeing him go we’re gonna have to find we’re gonna have to find like
200 million dollars here out of nowhere guys no problems we’ve got it it’s in a contingency fund which is how I think
people at Davis Love a third have kind of spun it and said look we’ve got these we’ve got these reserves we’ve been very
prudent and Now’s the Time to deploy the heavy artillery begs the question if that is true then they’ve got maybe one
year maybe two at best to kind of hope that sticks and then you know stops the
Leaky bucket if that is the case it’s unsustainable
and if it is sustainable then you know they’re probably doing all this
time yeah exactly what they’ve been doing that money because you know I’m guessing they’re not taking the money out of all the charitable stuff that the
money goes into I’m guessing those haven’t gone to zero overnight just to just to increase the purchase did you
hear the Phil Mickelson burn the other day it was brilliant he was only like an interview with Liv And he was like you
know I just think live is I mean he was on his live rhetoric as he does he’s like I just think Liv is just great for
the game it’s just changes in the game in every way and you know it’s really it’s really good that the players are
now earning more money in the PGA Tour it’s really good that they’ve magically found 200 million dollars you know kind of just literally just dropped at him
like how they magically bound 200 and carried on without even breaking sweat
it was like so good it’s sad that you know you know Mickelson’s really the big casualty and all this
um well hang on I’m not sure casualty is necessarily the right the right word there because he
you know he’s not conducted himself in the most upstanding way I think it’s a shame you wouldn’t be alone in that
would he you know he wouldn’t be alone in that well yeah but I think he he was a ringleader wasn’t he ultimately and this
is where I feel really conflicted actually because you know I don’t I don’t feel enamored at all with Liv and
the people who’ve gone over there and I remember you know go back to 150 open the rumors that live was um Smith was
going to go to live imminently he was just like oh Champion golfer of the year he’s going to live but this all just feels a bit fake and like this is the
oldest and most treasured trophy in our Sport and it’s just like
you know it’s not okay it’s surely is that not going to resonate with the number two player in the world as he was
then enough to stop him going over to just you know an event or a tour that
just is driven above all and I still believe this to be the case driven Above All by kind of greed and money
um so I do I do feel pretty um miffed about about the way things have gone and
and I don’t feel that comfortable with sporting live but at the same time it’s like the PGA Tour just seems to have
been so incompetent and so yeah yeah like again just like you know the
impression I think we all get is that players have been pleading with Monahan and others at the PGA Tour to reform it
for a number of years and they’ve not listened and so just like you know the lesser of two
evils almost at this point um I think it’s crazy
I think it’s interesting how the the governing bodies have almost stepped back from that a little bit as well so you know there was quite a bit of
pressure on if you remember quite early doors for the for them to sort of come out and say well you know your major exemptions
are gone so you know you can’t you can’t join live and then turn up the majors they’ve been they’ve abstained pretty
heavily on that also strange how DP World Tour has remained fairly I had all the Strategic Alliance
nonsense they have stayed they’ve kind of abstained from a little bit about I think DP World Tour a little
bit do you know no they’re they’re they’re clear on their argument Live players cannot play in their events the
only thing that’s preventing that from being enforced at the moment yeah ongoing Court appeals and they had a
very different outcome in the interim sort of judgment to what the PGA Tour had so yeah they’ve been a bit
aggressive on the uh BMW stuff haven’t they it’s going to start obviously this week on third or Thursday or Thursday
for them because they’ve been told categorically not to not to play in the Pro-Am on Wednesday and that um they
won’t feature in any of the featured groups that’s going to be on going to be televised on sky and everywhere else in
the world um I mean they think like the weirdest part about this is like
like there’s no getting around this now the live at the moment they went across to live
world rankings are quite strong now they’re much stronger than DP World Tour in terms of like their top 20 and what
they can get out there and the live guys are having to go and play in on the Asian tour just to try and get some real
rankings and the reality is that I’m not sure for me I’m not sure how
long they can continue to be ignored if you’ve got people like cam Smith DJ
kepca you know the Shambo they’re playing on the live tour the I don’t
think the sport can afford for these people just to disappear off the map and not be in Majors like bow wgr I know
Peter Dawson’s involved with that running that now and I’m sure they’re scratching their heads all over the show
about what they’re going to do but but you just can’t ignore those players
I think the problem is going to go but I think fundamentally there’s a problem now which is
how do we know who the best players in the world are because they’re not playing against one another that’s the fundamental issue that I
don’t see how the official World Golf Ranking can be expected to solve it because
Smith and Dustin Johnson are not going to meet Scotty Scheffler and Rory
McIlroy apart from four events per year well how can you do a well Golf Ranking on the base of those four events and you
know how can you do a World Golf Ranking and say well Cameron Smith went over to live ranked number four in the world that should adjust the strength of field
accordingly because you know all players go through Peaks and troughs DJ was not
the player when he moved over to live that he was two years ago when he was winning every single FedEx Cup event by
50 shots like you know when he went on that run and won the FedEx Cup by a country mile
um won the Masters comfortably as well and then has a massive sort of decline in form relative to those earlier
standards the following year it’s just that is the insurmountable problem I think for the official World Golf Ranking is you are not going to have the
best players playing against one another well I think that makes it even more important that they do play together four times a year because it’s almost
like a calibration you know it’s it that that is how they calibrate they play against each other four times a year and
they work out okay well this person finished above that person so can you imagine reset go again imagine if that
was the case with four events that the rankings would be nuts like you’d have guys that have come through qualifying
in the US Open that would be all of a sudden catapulted into you know kind of
exemption exempt status but I mean look there is no getting away from it any
dudes per se first first live event Centurion we finished seconded me from Mary or something like that you know the
the whole makeup of those events has changed that performance is significantly stronger in today’s live
world than it was several weeks ago so there has to be something that accounts for that strength of field and the
relative loss and the strength of the field in other areas and it can’t be the fact that they play these kind of 14 events with live and then disappear off
and grind away on the Asian tour for a few weeks and that’s going to keep them into the world top 50. it’s just not
going to be possible also their ranking are plummeting so you know it’s creating Headroom and probably some false you
know false rankings for players you know further down the packing order the playing principally in the US
um you know yeah you know I started why this was brought in though you know he was brought in as
a as a metric to try and work out who the best players in the world are and a
key assumption there is that those players are going to play against one another to use your common refrain Nils
the danger with the four Mage is being the yardstick is that it’s too small a sample size
yeah but they’re not going to have any more there’s that four is the maximum they’re ever going to have isn’t it unless they start doing some
something you know which amalgamates the tours but they’re never going to get any
more than four and they doesn’t even look like they’re gonna get four I I don’t know aren’t they you know Bubba Watson and
and Phil have obviously been asked about whether they anticipate they’ll be going to August next year I mean all eyes are
on Augusta National really they’re the ones who are gonna probably set the tone for what the majors decide
um how much of the PGA Tour do you think hangs on Rory’s shoulders now
because the whole thing you know I when you when you take Rory away from
from PGA Tour and you look at what’s left the makeup of the players is not vastly different to the the kind of the
top 40 playing live right like it’s not massively different in terms of names
Brands impact you know you’ve got really big Brands into their own right like DJ de chambo playing live you know Rory’s
I feel like the glue at the moment now he’s a generational player but
raw is probably not going to be well he’s not going to be winning tour championships in five six years time
would be my guess oh hang on there I wouldn’t rhyme off that quickly so I don’t know he’s no but
he’s been no but to family he’s been at the absolute top end of the game for a
long time like he’s a generational player isn’t he yeah he’s 30. you can’t he can’t hang on to that forever can he
like that’s just that’s just a fact of life hmm But my question is
okay maybe that’s a touch rush but at some point someone’s gonna have to step into that
void Rory is an enormous brand do you think Rory is as vehemently against Liv
as he makes out yeah I think so I think when it gets to the
point that you’re saying that much stuff in public to you know with the intensity that he’s
been saying I mean there was even a I think there was a clip posted online uh excerpt from his TOUR
Championship press conference where he talked about how he’s you know he really wasn’t going to look be looking forward to uh seeing those 12 players from Liv
coming over and playing the BMW at Wentworth this coming week and he’s like yeah I’m gonna find that really difficult to stomach actually you know
just went above and beyond the the kind of classic answer that a journalist is probably looking for in that in that in
that um in that moment um yeah I think he’s just been you know
he’s never never indulged the Saudi stuff never even when it was Saudi International on the European tour just
didn’t indulge it you know didn’t want to go and play it um yeah I I think he’s do you think a lot
of this is driven by his position on on the PGA tour and you know in his capacity is he’s too
big to go yeah he’s too big to go and it’s the same with Hideki isn’t it it’s like there’s a few players that almost
transcend that ability to to hop over and take a deal like that because they’re that they’re almost well they
are too big to do it it’s like there’s too much power in their hands well I suppose you know like it I think
it’s I think it’s quite obvious that raw is is in a compromised position where he just he physically couldn’t take an
offer even if it was a you know 10 figures from Liv he couldn’t take that he couldn’t take that deal but what but
why I’m not sure I’m not quite clear on why that’s the thing that’s the case because it would be ABS well because Nicholson’s a generational player like
Nicholson is the best player of the last 30 years
Nicholson has always is the same spokesman for the sport that
maybe Rory is you know the same could be said you know tiger you know moves the
needle bigger than the game transcends it all we’ve heard all the superlative same again applies to Tiger
you know Far East hidaki’s got a huge amount on his shoulder with the game as well there it’s almost like they’re just
too I don’t know how best to say it other than the fact that I just think they’re almost too big to to make that
kind of huge call do you think um Rory’s
uh aggression against live and and you know the fact he’s so so against it is
to do with the Saudi Arabia and where the money has come from or do you think it’s purely a fact of it’s a split it’s
basically dismantling the PGA Tour I think it’s the latter for sure I’ve never heard him say anything about the money I don’t think about the Saudi
money and the amount of money I don’t think I’ve really so quick to write that off I would be so
quick to write off his um moral issues that he has with it um you know by all accounts not that
I’ve really spent any appreciable time with them whatsoever but by all accounts he’s a sort of deeply conscientious and
and um nice person to to kind of speak with and interact with
um you know he obviously there’s a fair amount of um
evidence out there to suggest like he does gen genuinely enjoy kind of like reading and discussing politics um he’s
big into his sort of State philosophy as well he’s a big fan of like Ryan holiday Ryan holiday’s work you know he’s
invested in woop and self-care um he’s a fairly deep thinker I think as well about about
um just various issues you mean there’s pictures of him having breakfast with Bill Clinton and all sorts of stuff he’s
quite I think he’s probably quite a well-read person um and he enjoys taking on that role of
being spokesman for the game and um you know he’s just I think he just
really conducts himself well but I honestly do and I I think you know he he’d feel a huge amount of
disloyalty if he was just to abandon the tour that gave him a huge platform and
allowed him to succeed to the point that he’s at now I think that would just really you know be quite jarring in its
own right but also there’s definitely implications there about the source of the money
um the fact that it’s funded by the public investment fund of Saudi Arabia and
um yeah I I I I I don’t think he’s the kind of person he’s just
pretty self-absorbed and only concerned by money I think I wonder in in general
what would be the reaction to all this if it was like sponsored by or the money came from Haribo you know like it’s
about like if they just pulled that from are they on your desk
or something at the moment in Haribo no I was just thinking it’s like the least defensive company I could think of but
like yeah you know like if all the money came from like I don’t know selling teddy bears whether you’d get the same
reaction to all this and whether it’s just like a resistance to change rather than yeah you know because I seriously
feel like a lot of this stuff is just like it is just like the ultimate I just I’d like my pj tour I like my 72 holes I
just I just want to stay I do I agree I totally agree that there’s no doubt the PGA Tour is is operating solely to
protect its Monopoly that’s the I think that’s the the driving Point here is it’s you know that they have an absolute
Monopoly on the oppression on the game and it’s you know okay you know Liv just happened to be in
a position where they can fund it through you know a means which allows them to compete at least no one else has got that privilege open to them you know
therefore that money attracts a bit of adverse well a lot of adverse PR and probably quite rightly so but yeah
um you know there’s no doubt that the PGA Tours interested quash Live come
solely from uh from a standpoint of competition and and commanding a market share that they have that’s that’s
there’s no getting away from it I mean it does leave the whole game in a real strange place though President’s Cup
obviously coming up soon you know you’re looking at you know I mean you could
pretty much handicap the international place you could you could give them you could you could Peg them up a couple of shots better
um to compete I mean they’re going to be completely utterly outgunned aren’t they against the US side because now the you
know like cam Smith and yeah yeah I mean demon though as well
it’s about him who’s Tyson you know these these people are you know
that are no longer able to play in that event which is really the kind of you know outside of Europe and you know
it’s a it’s a it’s a it’s an insanely good good event I don’t think we really get behind it because we have to ride a
cup you know it’s still interesting to watch but it’s not you know it’s just it was great to watch over all Melbourne a
few years ago great to watch I think um for me what will be the interesting
moment will be as we go into the winter months and the PGA Tour circuit
typically quietens down and actually lives schedules going to be ramping up a little bit I think and seeing whether
there’s any competition for views there and whether we find ourselves thinking oh okay you
know the live Grand finals coming up in Saudi Arabia let’s flick it on and see who’s playing because you know the field
there is in all likelihood going to be far far stronger than those guys tearing it up
at the DP World Tour finale um you know by uh where is it the
Emirates of Dubai not the Emirates sorry the uh Jamira course at Dubai um I think that’s where it could get quite
juicy but because it’s the you know it feels like live there
he’s gonna have a better product in that moment but you know at the moment the 54
hole shotgun start when that’s put up against tall Championship or
um you know some of the other top tier PGA Tour events it just it just feels a bit um
a bit of a non-event live stuff I would almost argue that the Tour Championship is as good as I think Liv could ever
hoped to be because the Tour Championship was good it was a great event this year it’s great you know Rory
going to toe it’s got a shuffler that was insane um I I quite I quite enjoy that at them
point it’s worth but there isn’t really that much provenance to it you know really it is an exercise in handing out
huge checks to players so I I look at it and think well actually I’m missing the
best case for live is that they could end up with a series of events that are really kind of akin to a tour tour
Championship you know um yeah and a lot of the great stories of some you know rank Outsider making a
run and all of a sudden coming tearing through the field and giving someone a run for it I mean tigala was kind of
that guy really at the start of the start of the Season at the Phoenix the Waste Management Phoenix and all of a
sudden goes on has a great PGA Tour career but at the time no one really you know everyone was like oh this is a bit
of an unknown like where’s he kind of come from limited limited field events
just hard to see that happening in the same way just while we’re talking about your Championship do we feel like the
format was somewhat validated this year with you know having the
handicap system and someone that wasn’t in starting 10 shots ahead has gone on
to win it and I mean the fact that Rory started triple bogey bogey on his first
round and he’s already a zillion shots back is actually relatively impressive that he’s gone on
to do it but do we feel like the format is somewhat Vindicated because I think it works yeah I think it totally works
there if I’m being brutally honest my you know the the memory of Justin Rose winning the Tour Championship well not
no in fact didn’t win the Tour Championship Tiger winning the Tour Championship but then Rose winning that
FedEx do you remember that was almost like such a strange sort of a band or certainly strange sort
of victory for Rose and so much as he didn’t win the event but took home the the FedEx that whole thing just feels
weird a little bit so I I get it I get why they do it they want to have this big season finale to me definitely does
work certainly work this year like that was amazing but they never seem to guarantee that and most of the times
I’ve seen it tends to be one of a bit of a bit of a March doesn’t it you know I think you know Cantor and DJ want it
quite comfortably haven’t they in in recent memory well no actually you know the first time though the the first time
um they gave this this format a go mcroy won in 2019 the year after you know you
mentioned there when Justin Rose won the season-long race but tiger won the Tour Championship they debuted it McElroy
started like four under I think and then shot um I think 12 under for the for the four days ended up
um or 13 under the four days ended up 17 under total um it’s played into his hands again I mean
you know it’s obviously no great surprise but I think that kind of format plays really well into into McElroy
because you can just keep going without fear really holding on to a lead it’s no surprise
that both both of those occasions 2019 and this year he’s ended up winning because he’s just kind of been so far
back he’s almost like the shackles are off then you can just just go firing at pins and and posting the best numbers
you can really doesn’t know there’s no fear yeah I mean shaffer’s obviously the best player this season I kind of feel
like though I would enjoy it more I think I think he would be treated like a major more if
they the like the 30 that got into it and it’s like you know you go through the whole season and you go through the
the postseason and you get to the 30. and instead of it being like a rose can
win if he if he finishes fifth or better or this person’s handicapped by 10 shots
because I did this I just think if they all just started flatting like right 30 guys you’ve made it well done now go for
it like gloves are off just fight whoever wins wins I would be so much more interested I think if they all
start but scratch everyone had a chance to win and just go for it I get it but then you know where would that leave you
know I mean there’s a few guys in there but there’s nothing behind the scenes
in the season I get the way the PGA Tour wants to have it though like in lieu of having a major of their own or anything
I get why they want to have some sort of crowning moment for the best player of the Season amazingly the great thing
about this year is that Scotty Chef has had without doubt you know the most insane season
um in the game waves come from at the start of the year to now you know what he’s picked up on the way it’s truly remarkable but also like you forget just
how good a season Rory’s had like his you know his performance has been
mind-bendingly good this year almost as good as he’s ever played actually it just hasn’t quite worked in the major
championship world like we saw that thing that Justin Thomas put out before um you know kind of recapping on his
year goals at the end of the Tour Championship every year and it was really interesting seeing how he had put just one of his goals was just to you
know win an event and it’s like yeah you forget that these guys who are that good in the world like that’s a realistic
goal for them so you know okay Roy didn’t win a major this year and no day
he wanted two more than anything else but there’s no get away from the fact just how Bloody good we’re always been
this year and I think sometimes we use the Mage as a bit of a benchmark as to whether it’s been a success or a fail
but I I get it I know what your emails like you kind of start them off on 11 play at Level Playing Field but
I don’t know well on that note I think it’s a nice way to almost come full circle on the top of this pod because um
you know macro is obviously taken home what is it 18 million dollars for winning the Tour Championship there
um maybe you’re going to correct me and tell me someone did ask him but the great question
in the context of the live discussion we’ve been having is having so far is would he trade that 18 million dollars
for a major in 2022 the answer is probably almost certainly yes yeah I
think I can answer on his behalf there he would that’s that’s easy when you’ve got plenty that is the great irony of of
the Thor championship and what the PGA Tour is kind of set out to do is that you know their Talis man they’re the
best player this season the generational Talent as you quietly right quite rightly point out Sam he’d have probably
given all of that money up if he could have just had a major activities name a few more putts that Saint Andrews on
Sunday yeah exactly hey hey just quickly because we’ve just like we’ve talked
about loads of stuff today but what about shorts but not doing this we’re not playing
this game you’re not goading me yeah I I um I’m not playing these silly games I’m
unsure really I’m just gonna leave it there I’m just gonna leave it there we’re gonna put it out there it’s gonna probably if you like it take it if you
don’t do what you like with it pair of long socks we’ve already started we’ve called in
the teams The Crushers the niblicks the iron heads it’s like who the who the
hell cares if they’re wearing shorts now the game’s gone so far away from where
it was it’s like Jesus yeah I I find it yeah it’s just like
picky battles those you know it’s like you really think for Liv it’s like yeah we might as well
because it’s just a cheap shot isn’t it in a way yeah exactly kind of a fine fair enough one it’s like yeah and you know what we’re also better than PGA
Tour because you can wear shorts here wait and probably all the players are like
you know what it’s not a game changer for me actually the fact that I can’t wear shorts on the PGA tour isn’t going
to be enough of an incentive to push me over to live but who knows that’s just my take but
it’s only a matter of time before like Greg Norman does a like a focus group that with a bunch of random golf or a
bunch of random non-golfers where they’re like how do we get people into the game and half the focus could come back we’re like oh well Brooke’s cab
because it’s pretty jacked it’d be quite good to see him playing topless he’s like that’s a great idea
that would be good I would watch that actually Pat Perez less so
could you imagine that press playing topless and on that bombshell until next time thank you very much for tuning in
Tom Bales and today I’m joined by Bruce Fitzpatrick good day or good
evening and Sir Sam Williams have a gentlemen Asia since we’ve potted
together absolutely bloody ages yeah it has been it has been a while well we
were going to get together weren’t we last week and do a little podcast but uh your house moved Tom and by the way if
you want to hear more about Tom’s house move spoiler alert for the church Stratton course Diaries podcast coming
up very soon um but obviously sandwiched between raw North Devon and you going to Spain as
well Bruce it’s been a little bit hectic on the golfing front since season is here we’ve been getting out playing a
bit it’s a wonderful time of year to play golf isn’t it as the sort of I mean it’ll be strictly an awesome probably summer I guess or something but yeah
we’re edging into water it certainly feels like Autumn busy period um how is Spain Spain was very good fun
thanks um yeah played a little bit of golf uh in the south of Spain so that was that was uh enjoyable we need to do a course
Diaries podcast which will be inbound shortly on um Royal North Devon of course we don’t want to overlook that
the Cradle of English golf much to dissect and discuss there yeah very good
and I did spot you posted a little picture of yourself in Spain Bruce and then the DMS were a light and obviously
I’m Man mark in the social media asking me was it last precess I had absolutely no idea so I just ignored the messages
yeah that was the course played on um on Saturday yeah
team what’s it like oh um which hole is in Rob McGovern
that’s a really good question no definitely wasn’t the 18th I’ll tell you right now it might be the 12th
okay it’s just got it to handle you know he just pull it up he’s just he’s such a consummate professional with all these
things he’s like I tell you now no problem at all well the great thing is you know I I put them in the I put them
in the chat in the in the episode notes it’s the eighth I thought it was around seven or eight it’s the eight yeah
risk and reward part five classic sort of heroic goal fall with water in front of the green much like the 12th there I
think I think there is actually something to be said about um golf in the Mediterranean region because
I mean friend of the Pod Malcolm duck called it sort of gin and Tony yeah and
I think you know by and large um yeah I I don’t know if that really
captures it I think there’s a lot of heroic Golf out there there’s quite you know you know how um
sad and obsessive Harry and I can be about you know playing off back tees and playing with slope rating and seeing you
know how difficult the courses are out there and actually Bruce
the courses out there um are yeah very very highly rated on on
slope because there is just so much water and there’s so much architecture in the kind of mold of heroic golf
really um I don’t know it’s the for me personally I don’t think many of the
courses out there um have the same kind of charm and an architectural appeal as a lot of courses
in in the United Kingdom but that’s not to say they’re not great and good fun to
play on their own Merit I just think that yeah there’s there’s Maybe
less variety um yeah in Spain in Spanish and Portuguese
golf but I would be happy to be proven wrong there if anyone’s got any recommendations of some some Great Courses to go and play
um we’re fortunate enough to play for a couple of days at valarama which I think is is a really quite unique course
um that’s probably quite different to you know the mold that I mentioned just there because that is
um much more sort of tree line it was the obviously the infamous Court trees
small greens um not an overabundance of water there makes it uh makes it slightly different
but yeah I think I mean you’ve played a little bit of gold fan in Portugal haven’t you Sam and Tommy if you you’ve
played there too I’ve seen you remember yeah I’d agree it’s a little bit a little bit kind of similar similar brand throughout isn’t it I mean there’ll be
some little the problem is you tend to fly into these big big kind of resorts destinations don’t you so that’s where
they tend to stick the you know the kind of more you know newly built courses water solder and like you say a little
bit longer Championship tests I dare say if you really went off the Beaten Track in Spain and you know I’d love to get
out and play padrino I’d love to go and see some of the some of the Charming places that sit up in the hillsides and stuff because they’ve got to be there in
abundance but anyway that’s not the reason we’re here gentlemen no we want to do a little recap on the on the
goings on the World of Golf law Lord knows there’s plenty of it at the moment I don’t even know how we start to to uh
to kind of get our way through this but it feels like so much there’s obviously the whole thing around live we’ve just
come off the back of the DJs inaugural live Victory
um which you know I to be honest with you I don’t think they could have they
couldn’t have bought a better um finale to to the event if they’d tried and it seemed to pass without kind
of too much note I don’t know if you noticed but you know DJ winning with an eagle on the first playoff hole was just
um absolutely I mean it’s it’s arguably great TV if that was if that was PGA Tour that would have been that would
have been one of the highlights of the season it’s actually kind of passed through that too much Affair have you noticed yeah and this is definitely a
theme we need to um pick up on and maybe it’s not worth going down the rabbit hole now but it seems like
um mainstream golf media Outlets have made a stand in terms of not particularly on on you know the usual
suspects in terms of social media channels Instagram Twitter Facebook they’re not giving it anywhere near as
much oxygen as they used to it’s like no no you know one little post DJs one four
and a half million and that’s it um it’s remarkable isn’t it the thing is
it is the biggest story in the game right now there’s no getting away from it you know and live the developments in the PGA
Tour it’s the biggest story it’s almost like it’s become like an embargo topic have you noticed yeah
and that hardened Twitter verse that just you know I wouldn’t watch I
wouldn’t watch live if you know if my life depended on it and it’s just it’s so people are so worked up on
you know the source of the funds and whether or not it’s ethical to watch it and if the players are sold out but the
I think the mainstream media have died off a little bit in terms of how
aggressive they’ve been towards it although you’ve got a few that are still really trying to Bang the Drum against
it and then you’ve got a whole bunch of people that are I think as it progresses I mean it doesn’t
appear like it’s getting tons of views like the views on the YouTube live aren’t phenomenal but like I don’t
really know how how that compares to the PGA Tour 17 000 views it’s not that it’s not phenomenal
it’s abject I mean like just by any measure that’s just terrible really 70
000 views on YouTube I mean I I don’t I’m not digging watching it I haven’t been watching it I’ve been like you know
edge of the seat and stuff and I don’t know why it’s not because the tournament because of the
tournaments not because I have any particular views against it um there is some sort of atmosphere when
Matt wolf slam dunked is is the t-shirt on the part three and had you know they’re all howling like wolves it was
all a bit you know bizarre there is actually some atmosphere but like I’m
I just I cannot explain why but I just can’t watch it
for more than 20 minutes without being yeah no I totally agree that’s that’s the weirdest thing with this isn’t it you know I’ve I’ve kind of criticized
the first couple of events because it has just been like exhibition golf it’s like there’s nothing to see you’re watching them
kind of meandered around for three rounds I think the broadcast is like littered with this sort of backslapping
culture about you know welcome to live you know as soon as someone hits it within 10 feet of the flag which is a
bit nauseating but the tournaments haven’t delivered you could argue though last weekend it
really did deliver and it was a great tournament but like you say no one really got up for it it’s it’s a really
strange one but obviously that’s coming off the back of a huge amount of player announcements yeah you know I think
that’s worth us talking through in a little bit you know obviously the players that came across I think you
know maybe some of the some of the ones that didn’t come yeah so let’s kind of walk it back so let’s walk it back to I
think we’ve not really covered it in great detail since the 150th open um that concluded on the 17th of July I
think it’s fair to say we were aware on the ground that there were murmurings and indeed it was brought up in cam
Smith post Championship presser that he was going to go to live the following day yeah which he obviously didn’t and
then that was subsequently amended to say well there’s murmurings that he wants to play in the FedEx Cup playoffs
he might want to play Presidents Cup a lot of speculation but it felt like the
150th open was a bit of a turning point because you had Martin Slumbers Chief eject to the RNA coming out and giving
quite a um sort of well-articulated passionate defense of
the sort of status quo along with tiger as well who for ages had remained pretty quiet on the
topic but gave probably his longest um and most considered
um the announcement of the of Live And The Format what it stood for
what it meant for younger players and since then it’s just kind of picked up pace really it felt like the 150th open
was like you know um the Battle Cry really in it and since then it’s just gotten more and more
um acrimonious between the two sides yeah and like the PGA Tour just just kind of you know reflecting on the last
few weeks of almost you know rather than do anything to build Bridges towards because what you’ve what you’ve now got
this situation is where the international players are fleeing on mass heading out to go and play this you
know kind of a you know strip backs um kind of series of commitments different
events going into live right it’s not really that attractive to the
vast majority of the PGA players okay you’ve got people like Patrick reader going et cetera but you know by and large it’s more attractive to
International um golfers and then you’ve got the PGA Tour that seems to have gone the
opposite direction and basically just going yeah I’m going to double down on this I’m going to make this almost an exclusively PGA Tour
um kind of us brand um they’ve done everything they can I would say to not kind of play to the the
stuff that they were looking at Beyond kind of increasing purses you know all the other elevated events you know
monaghan’s come out and said don’t think the Scottish is he’s basically refused to confirm whether Scottish will be one
of those elevated events it kind of looks like it’s just going to be used to alternate across it if I don’t know how
to come out and confirm the Scottish I thought the Scottish I think he said it’ll alternate so I think you know
there’s obviously this commitment to is it 20 elevated purses throughout the
year sit or 12 elevated but that was interesting in and of itself oh did you
hear John Ram’s comments on this you know so Rahm was like spitting
feathers about it because he found out during an interview with him as he was like an oppressor and they were like oh
so you got to play 20 events and you’ve committed to that and he was
like well I haven’t committed to it and I got to like yeah you’ve got to it’s the whatever it works out as the four
majors the players and of course you know the whatever
but then obviously the Europeans that are still on um from a PGA Tour like Rory Ram
Fitzpatrick hovland um hat and low allowry
they’ve still got to play a certain amount of the DP World Tour
to qualify for the Ryder Cup so they will certainly have a
an uh fixture list which is like almost it’s never going to save the
money it’s not gonna I don’t think any of this is going to actually result in significantly less gold for these
players no he wasn’t talking about it saving them many golf but he was like I can’t physically commit to that many because because I’ve got to I’ve got to
go and play the DP World Tour as well because I’ve got to get my Ryder Cup status so he was suggesting that something or
basically suggesting you need to go out to Rory because Rory will give you the answer but when the DB World Tour qualification process
um will have to change so they don’t have to go qualify in Europe with the DP World Tour or
whether they won’t have to commit to the 20 events in the PGA but it obviously it’s all so fresh like they just come
from you know 90 Wing in it really well yeah I think the the the DP Ryder Cup
requirement that that needs to be that’ll be ironed out um
later I I feel you know the the 20 event minimum is the story here because for
many years or you know the the 15 um tournament requirement on the PGA
tour was the sort of yardstick as it were and and whenever Liv came along and said well we’re only going to require
our players to play in 14 that was the refrain of the Defenders of the PGA Tours well it was only a 15 event
requirement that’s now been boosted to 20 but you have this weird sort of bifurcation almost with 12 of those
20 events being elevated events and that’s Century tournament champions the
Genesis Arnold Palmer there’s WGC Bell Max play I think the memorials won
um the BMW TOUR Championship again I mean that’s just sort of by the by there’s not really much to change there
in essence they’re just kind of formalizing the the events which people
already consider to be the most important are in fact going to be the most important and compensated that way financially but this requirement that
they’re going to get the top players together at those events is is the key difference I think because they’re
saying that
so I mean this is this is the strange thing with this it has become you know there’s always been this discussion the
PGA Tour is meritocratic you know you you get into a field on a Monday through through Q school or whatever you kind of
you turn up to Monday qualify you can find yourself in the event on Thursday you make the cut you can go home with
some money now these elevated events are going to be closed off they’re going to be really ring fence to the elite players
those elite players are going to be determined by media mentions Google search all those kind of things you know
how much they resonate with the fan base so all the ones that aren’t within that elevated kind of you know aren’t
elevated events as such where they’re playing for 20 million dollars stuff like the Shriners whatever they’re going
to be you know I hate to say it but they’re also run events they kind of are already like you know which events are
going to be worth tuning in for but it’s it’s a really strange one you’ve almost prohibited a large number of players
there from playing in any of these elevated events um sorry you’re the PIP thing just to
clarify though I I’m not sure the players are getting into these
events on the basis of pip rankings I think so 20 20. yeah so 20 20 spots will be
ring fence for this sort of elevated Series where they will be essentially mandated to play in 13 of
the elevated events and three others that they’re choosing um because for someone like Fowler he’s
the example of someone who engages quite highly on the pit but because he’s ranked outside the top 100 in the world
question marks as to whether he’d only get into those events for which he is actually eligible based on world ranking
yeah that’s correct
because I think the facts are out there people can go out and find them you know if they want to find them what do you
think about all this what do you think about um the fact that the PGA Tour and Jay
Monaghan has reacted the way that he has do you think it’s the right thing to do
do you think you just basically knee-jerking the whole thing or do you um what do you think
well I think it’s had to happen but you’ve summed it up bedtime like it’s reactive it’s totally reactive and
doesn’t seem particularly fresh or original
um who knows I mean time will tell as to whether it’s a you know their positive changes
but um yeah no one no one could be you know saying the PGA PJ tour should be winning
prizes for originality and creative thinking the the greatest kind of um
signal to me is that all those stories about why the PGA Tour couldn’t
expand and increase prize funds and increase some of the incentives and
um you know stuff like the PIP for example all that just seems to be complete
bollocks because they’ve done it overnight you know and I think that’s the real concern they just they just found it they’ve literally just found it
as soon as there was a threat and I the idea that all that money is just locked out again I mean until live golf came
along doesn’t seem to me to be a particularly satisfactory answer so um I mean that’s the story I think needs
to be told it’s like why is it that Jay Monahan’s been raking in somewhere between seven and 14 million dollars for
the last I don’t know five years or since he’s been commissioner that’s you know widely estimated to be I mean in fact
some of it’s publicly available information so it’s not it’s not estimated it’s fact but in and around you know the range of seven million
dollars to 14 million dollars is probably the most highly um
paid commissioner in American Sports based on the actual Revenue which the PGA Tour generates I mean he he kind of
outweighs uh NBA and um NFL MLB
equivalent I’d love to see the statistics I bet you Jay Monahan earns more than the average PGA wage
yeah yeah 100 yeah I mean I mean what’s the average take home on PGA Tour for
your average carded player would be sub three million dollars would be my guess but that’s not all the story is it because again he’s creating value for
all the players so I don’t think is he creating value no that’s the argument isn’t it like I don’t think I don’t think he has been adding value I mean
I’d like I wonder what sort of I’d be really interested to just see how that whole conversation had flowed seeing
these lit events that live unfold and just then seeing him go we’re gonna have to find we’re gonna have to find like
200 million dollars here out of nowhere guys no problems we’ve got it it’s in a contingency fund which is how I think
people at Davis Love a third have kind of spun it and said look we’ve got these we’ve got these reserves we’ve been very
prudent and Now’s the Time to deploy the heavy artillery begs the question if that is true then they’ve got maybe one
year maybe two at best to kind of hope that sticks and then you know stops the
Leaky bucket if that is the case it’s unsustainable
and if it is sustainable then you know they’re probably doing all this
time yeah exactly what they’ve been doing that money because you know I’m guessing they’re not taking the money out of all the charitable stuff that the
money goes into I’m guessing those haven’t gone to zero overnight just to just to increase the purchase did you
hear the Phil Mickelson burn the other day it was brilliant he was only like an interview with Liv And he was like you
know I just think live is I mean he was on his live rhetoric as he does he’s like I just think Liv is just great for
the game it’s just changes in the game in every way and you know it’s really it’s really good that the players are
now earning more money in the PGA Tour it’s really good that they’ve magically found 200 million dollars you know kind of just literally just dropped at him
like how they magically bound 200 and carried on without even breaking sweat
it was like so good it’s sad that you know you know Mickelson’s really the big casualty and all this
um well hang on I’m not sure casualty is necessarily the right the right word there because he
you know he’s not conducted himself in the most upstanding way I think it’s a shame you wouldn’t be alone in that
would he you know he wouldn’t be alone in that well yeah but I think he he was a ringleader wasn’t he ultimately and this
is where I feel really conflicted actually because you know I don’t I don’t feel enamored at all with Liv and
the people who’ve gone over there and I remember you know go back to 150 open the rumors that live was um Smith was
going to go to live imminently he was just like oh Champion golfer of the year he’s going to live but this all just feels a bit fake and like this is the
oldest and most treasured trophy in our Sport and it’s just like
you know it’s not okay it’s surely is that not going to resonate with the number two player in the world as he was
then enough to stop him going over to just you know an event or a tour that
just is driven above all and I still believe this to be the case driven Above All by kind of greed and money
um so I do I do feel pretty um miffed about about the way things have gone and
and I don’t feel that comfortable with sporting live but at the same time it’s like the PGA Tour just seems to have
been so incompetent and so yeah yeah like again just like you know the
impression I think we all get is that players have been pleading with Monahan and others at the PGA Tour to reform it
for a number of years and they’ve not listened and so just like you know the lesser of two
evils almost at this point um I think it’s crazy
I think it’s interesting how the the governing bodies have almost stepped back from that a little bit as well so you know there was quite a bit of
pressure on if you remember quite early doors for the for them to sort of come out and say well you know your major exemptions
are gone so you know you can’t you can’t join live and then turn up the majors they’ve been they’ve abstained pretty
heavily on that also strange how DP World Tour has remained fairly I had all the Strategic Alliance
nonsense they have stayed they’ve kind of abstained from a little bit about I think DP World Tour a little
bit do you know no they’re they’re they’re clear on their argument Live players cannot play in their events the
only thing that’s preventing that from being enforced at the moment yeah ongoing Court appeals and they had a
very different outcome in the interim sort of judgment to what the PGA Tour had so yeah they’ve been a bit
aggressive on the uh BMW stuff haven’t they it’s going to start obviously this week on third or Thursday or Thursday
for them because they’ve been told categorically not to not to play in the Pro-Am on Wednesday and that um they
won’t feature in any of the featured groups that’s going to be on going to be televised on sky and everywhere else in
the world um I mean they think like the weirdest part about this is like
like there’s no getting around this now the live at the moment they went across to live
world rankings are quite strong now they’re much stronger than DP World Tour in terms of like their top 20 and what
they can get out there and the live guys are having to go and play in on the Asian tour just to try and get some real
rankings and the reality is that I’m not sure for me I’m not sure how
long they can continue to be ignored if you’ve got people like cam Smith DJ
kepca you know the Shambo they’re playing on the live tour the I don’t
think the sport can afford for these people just to disappear off the map and not be in Majors like bow wgr I know
Peter Dawson’s involved with that running that now and I’m sure they’re scratching their heads all over the show
about what they’re going to do but but you just can’t ignore those players
I think the problem is going to go but I think fundamentally there’s a problem now which is
how do we know who the best players in the world are because they’re not playing against one another that’s the fundamental issue that I
don’t see how the official World Golf Ranking can be expected to solve it because
Smith and Dustin Johnson are not going to meet Scotty Scheffler and Rory
McIlroy apart from four events per year well how can you do a well Golf Ranking on the base of those four events and you
know how can you do a World Golf Ranking and say well Cameron Smith went over to live ranked number four in the world that should adjust the strength of field
accordingly because you know all players go through Peaks and troughs DJ was not
the player when he moved over to live that he was two years ago when he was winning every single FedEx Cup event by
50 shots like you know when he went on that run and won the FedEx Cup by a country mile
um won the Masters comfortably as well and then has a massive sort of decline in form relative to those earlier
standards the following year it’s just that is the insurmountable problem I think for the official World Golf Ranking is you are not going to have the
best players playing against one another well I think that makes it even more important that they do play together four times a year because it’s almost
like a calibration you know it’s it that that is how they calibrate they play against each other four times a year and
they work out okay well this person finished above that person so can you imagine reset go again imagine if that
was the case with four events that the rankings would be nuts like you’d have guys that have come through qualifying
in the US Open that would be all of a sudden catapulted into you know kind of
exemption exempt status but I mean look there is no getting away from it any
dudes per se first first live event Centurion we finished seconded me from Mary or something like that you know the
the whole makeup of those events has changed that performance is significantly stronger in today’s live
world than it was several weeks ago so there has to be something that accounts for that strength of field and the
relative loss and the strength of the field in other areas and it can’t be the fact that they play these kind of 14 events with live and then disappear off
and grind away on the Asian tour for a few weeks and that’s going to keep them into the world top 50. it’s just not
going to be possible also their ranking are plummeting so you know it’s creating Headroom and probably some false you
know false rankings for players you know further down the packing order the playing principally in the US
um you know yeah you know I started why this was brought in though you know he was brought in as
a as a metric to try and work out who the best players in the world are and a
key assumption there is that those players are going to play against one another to use your common refrain Nils
the danger with the four Mage is being the yardstick is that it’s too small a sample size
yeah but they’re not going to have any more there’s that four is the maximum they’re ever going to have isn’t it unless they start doing some
something you know which amalgamates the tours but they’re never going to get any
more than four and they doesn’t even look like they’re gonna get four I I don’t know aren’t they you know Bubba Watson and
and Phil have obviously been asked about whether they anticipate they’ll be going to August next year I mean all eyes are
on Augusta National really they’re the ones who are gonna probably set the tone for what the majors decide
um how much of the PGA Tour do you think hangs on Rory’s shoulders now
because the whole thing you know I when you when you take Rory away from
from PGA Tour and you look at what’s left the makeup of the players is not vastly different to the the kind of the
top 40 playing live right like it’s not massively different in terms of names
Brands impact you know you’ve got really big Brands into their own right like DJ de chambo playing live you know Rory’s
I feel like the glue at the moment now he’s a generational player but
raw is probably not going to be well he’s not going to be winning tour championships in five six years time
would be my guess oh hang on there I wouldn’t rhyme off that quickly so I don’t know he’s no but
he’s been no but to family he’s been at the absolute top end of the game for a
long time like he’s a generational player isn’t he yeah he’s 30. you can’t he can’t hang on to that forever can he
like that’s just that’s just a fact of life hmm But my question is
okay maybe that’s a touch rush but at some point someone’s gonna have to step into that
void Rory is an enormous brand do you think Rory is as vehemently against Liv
as he makes out yeah I think so I think when it gets to the
point that you’re saying that much stuff in public to you know with the intensity that he’s
been saying I mean there was even a I think there was a clip posted online uh excerpt from his TOUR
Championship press conference where he talked about how he’s you know he really wasn’t going to look be looking forward to uh seeing those 12 players from Liv
coming over and playing the BMW at Wentworth this coming week and he’s like yeah I’m gonna find that really difficult to stomach actually you know
just went above and beyond the the kind of classic answer that a journalist is probably looking for in that in that in
that um in that moment um yeah I think he’s just been you know
he’s never never indulged the Saudi stuff never even when it was Saudi International on the European tour just
didn’t indulge it you know didn’t want to go and play it um yeah I I think he’s do you think a lot
of this is driven by his position on on the PGA tour and you know in his capacity is he’s too
big to go yeah he’s too big to go and it’s the same with Hideki isn’t it it’s like there’s a few players that almost
transcend that ability to to hop over and take a deal like that because they’re that they’re almost well they
are too big to do it it’s like there’s too much power in their hands well I suppose you know like it I think
it’s I think it’s quite obvious that raw is is in a compromised position where he just he physically couldn’t take an
offer even if it was a you know 10 figures from Liv he couldn’t take that he couldn’t take that deal but what but
why I’m not sure I’m not quite clear on why that’s the thing that’s the case because it would be ABS well because Nicholson’s a generational player like
Nicholson is the best player of the last 30 years
Nicholson has always is the same spokesman for the sport that
maybe Rory is you know the same could be said you know tiger you know moves the
needle bigger than the game transcends it all we’ve heard all the superlative same again applies to Tiger
you know Far East hidaki’s got a huge amount on his shoulder with the game as well there it’s almost like they’re just
too I don’t know how best to say it other than the fact that I just think they’re almost too big to to make that
kind of huge call do you think um Rory’s
uh aggression against live and and you know the fact he’s so so against it is
to do with the Saudi Arabia and where the money has come from or do you think it’s purely a fact of it’s a split it’s
basically dismantling the PGA Tour I think it’s the latter for sure I’ve never heard him say anything about the money I don’t think about the Saudi
money and the amount of money I don’t think I’ve really so quick to write that off I would be so
quick to write off his um moral issues that he has with it um you know by all accounts not that
I’ve really spent any appreciable time with them whatsoever but by all accounts he’s a sort of deeply conscientious and
and um nice person to to kind of speak with and interact with
um you know he obviously there’s a fair amount of um
evidence out there to suggest like he does gen genuinely enjoy kind of like reading and discussing politics um he’s
big into his sort of State philosophy as well he’s a big fan of like Ryan holiday Ryan holiday’s work you know he’s
invested in woop and self-care um he’s a fairly deep thinker I think as well about about
um just various issues you mean there’s pictures of him having breakfast with Bill Clinton and all sorts of stuff he’s
quite I think he’s probably quite a well-read person um and he enjoys taking on that role of
being spokesman for the game and um you know he’s just I think he just
really conducts himself well but I honestly do and I I think you know he he’d feel a huge amount of
disloyalty if he was just to abandon the tour that gave him a huge platform and
allowed him to succeed to the point that he’s at now I think that would just really you know be quite jarring in its
own right but also there’s definitely implications there about the source of the money
um the fact that it’s funded by the public investment fund of Saudi Arabia and
um yeah I I I I I don’t think he’s the kind of person he’s just
pretty self-absorbed and only concerned by money I think I wonder in in general
what would be the reaction to all this if it was like sponsored by or the money came from Haribo you know like it’s
about like if they just pulled that from are they on your desk
or something at the moment in Haribo no I was just thinking it’s like the least defensive company I could think of but
like yeah you know like if all the money came from like I don’t know selling teddy bears whether you’d get the same
reaction to all this and whether it’s just like a resistance to change rather than yeah you know because I seriously
feel like a lot of this stuff is just like it is just like the ultimate I just I’d like my pj tour I like my 72 holes I
just I just want to stay I do I agree I totally agree that there’s no doubt the PGA Tour is is operating solely to
protect its Monopoly that’s the I think that’s the the driving Point here is it’s you know that they have an absolute
Monopoly on the oppression on the game and it’s you know okay you know Liv just happened to be in
a position where they can fund it through you know a means which allows them to compete at least no one else has got that privilege open to them you know
therefore that money attracts a bit of adverse well a lot of adverse PR and probably quite rightly so but yeah
um you know there’s no doubt that the PGA Tours interested quash Live come
solely from uh from a standpoint of competition and and commanding a market share that they have that’s that’s
there’s no getting away from it I mean it does leave the whole game in a real strange place though President’s Cup
obviously coming up soon you know you’re looking at you know I mean you could
pretty much handicap the international place you could you could give them you could you could Peg them up a couple of shots better
um to compete I mean they’re going to be completely utterly outgunned aren’t they against the US side because now the you
know like cam Smith and yeah yeah I mean demon though as well
it’s about him who’s Tyson you know these these people are you know
that are no longer able to play in that event which is really the kind of you know outside of Europe and you know
it’s a it’s a it’s a it’s an insanely good good event I don’t think we really get behind it because we have to ride a
cup you know it’s still interesting to watch but it’s not you know it’s just it was great to watch over all Melbourne a
few years ago great to watch I think um for me what will be the interesting
moment will be as we go into the winter months and the PGA Tour circuit
typically quietens down and actually lives schedules going to be ramping up a little bit I think and seeing whether
there’s any competition for views there and whether we find ourselves thinking oh okay you
know the live Grand finals coming up in Saudi Arabia let’s flick it on and see who’s playing because you know the field
there is in all likelihood going to be far far stronger than those guys tearing it up
at the DP World Tour finale um you know by uh where is it the
Emirates of Dubai not the Emirates sorry the uh Jamira course at Dubai um I think that’s where it could get quite
juicy but because it’s the you know it feels like live there
he’s gonna have a better product in that moment but you know at the moment the 54
hole shotgun start when that’s put up against tall Championship or
um you know some of the other top tier PGA Tour events it just it just feels a bit um
a bit of a non-event live stuff I would almost argue that the Tour Championship is as good as I think Liv could ever
hoped to be because the Tour Championship was good it was a great event this year it’s great you know Rory
going to toe it’s got a shuffler that was insane um I I quite I quite enjoy that at them
point it’s worth but there isn’t really that much provenance to it you know really it is an exercise in handing out
huge checks to players so I I look at it and think well actually I’m missing the
best case for live is that they could end up with a series of events that are really kind of akin to a tour tour
Championship you know um yeah and a lot of the great stories of some you know rank Outsider making a
run and all of a sudden coming tearing through the field and giving someone a run for it I mean tigala was kind of
that guy really at the start of the start of the Season at the Phoenix the Waste Management Phoenix and all of a
sudden goes on has a great PGA Tour career but at the time no one really you know everyone was like oh this is a bit
of an unknown like where’s he kind of come from limited limited field events
just hard to see that happening in the same way just while we’re talking about your Championship do we feel like the
format was somewhat validated this year with you know having the
handicap system and someone that wasn’t in starting 10 shots ahead has gone on
to win it and I mean the fact that Rory started triple bogey bogey on his first
round and he’s already a zillion shots back is actually relatively impressive that he’s gone on
to do it but do we feel like the format is somewhat Vindicated because I think it works yeah I think it totally works
there if I’m being brutally honest my you know the the memory of Justin Rose winning the Tour Championship well not
no in fact didn’t win the Tour Championship Tiger winning the Tour Championship but then Rose winning that
FedEx do you remember that was almost like such a strange sort of a band or certainly strange sort
of victory for Rose and so much as he didn’t win the event but took home the the FedEx that whole thing just feels
weird a little bit so I I get it I get why they do it they want to have this big season finale to me definitely does
work certainly work this year like that was amazing but they never seem to guarantee that and most of the times
I’ve seen it tends to be one of a bit of a bit of a March doesn’t it you know I think you know Cantor and DJ want it
quite comfortably haven’t they in in recent memory well no actually you know the first time though the the first time
um they gave this this format a go mcroy won in 2019 the year after you know you
mentioned there when Justin Rose won the season-long race but tiger won the Tour Championship they debuted it McElroy
started like four under I think and then shot um I think 12 under for the for the four days ended up
um or 13 under the four days ended up 17 under total um it’s played into his hands again I mean
you know it’s obviously no great surprise but I think that kind of format plays really well into into McElroy
because you can just keep going without fear really holding on to a lead it’s no surprise
that both both of those occasions 2019 and this year he’s ended up winning because he’s just kind of been so far
back he’s almost like the shackles are off then you can just just go firing at pins and and posting the best numbers
you can really doesn’t know there’s no fear yeah I mean shaffer’s obviously the best player this season I kind of feel
like though I would enjoy it more I think I think he would be treated like a major more if
they the like the 30 that got into it and it’s like you know you go through the whole season and you go through the
the postseason and you get to the 30. and instead of it being like a rose can
win if he if he finishes fifth or better or this person’s handicapped by 10 shots
because I did this I just think if they all just started flatting like right 30 guys you’ve made it well done now go for
it like gloves are off just fight whoever wins wins I would be so much more interested I think if they all
start but scratch everyone had a chance to win and just go for it I get it but then you know where would that leave you
know I mean there’s a few guys in there but there’s nothing behind the scenes
in the season I get the way the PGA Tour wants to have it though like in lieu of having a major of their own or anything
I get why they want to have some sort of crowning moment for the best player of the Season amazingly the great thing
about this year is that Scotty Chef has had without doubt you know the most insane season
um in the game waves come from at the start of the year to now you know what he’s picked up on the way it’s truly remarkable but also like you forget just
how good a season Rory’s had like his you know his performance has been
mind-bendingly good this year almost as good as he’s ever played actually it just hasn’t quite worked in the major
championship world like we saw that thing that Justin Thomas put out before um you know kind of recapping on his
year goals at the end of the Tour Championship every year and it was really interesting seeing how he had put just one of his goals was just to you
know win an event and it’s like yeah you forget that these guys who are that good in the world like that’s a realistic
goal for them so you know okay Roy didn’t win a major this year and no day
he wanted two more than anything else but there’s no get away from the fact just how Bloody good we’re always been
this year and I think sometimes we use the Mage as a bit of a benchmark as to whether it’s been a success or a fail
but I I get it I know what your emails like you kind of start them off on 11 play at Level Playing Field but
I don’t know well on that note I think it’s a nice way to almost come full circle on the top of this pod because um
you know macro is obviously taken home what is it 18 million dollars for winning the Tour Championship there
um maybe you’re going to correct me and tell me someone did ask him but the great question
in the context of the live discussion we’ve been having is having so far is would he trade that 18 million dollars
for a major in 2022 the answer is probably almost certainly yes yeah I
think I can answer on his behalf there he would that’s that’s easy when you’ve got plenty that is the great irony of of
the Thor championship and what the PGA Tour is kind of set out to do is that you know their Talis man they’re the
best player this season the generational Talent as you quietly right quite rightly point out Sam he’d have probably
given all of that money up if he could have just had a major activities name a few more putts that Saint Andrews on
Sunday yeah exactly hey hey just quickly because we’ve just like we’ve talked
about loads of stuff today but what about shorts but not doing this we’re not playing
this game you’re not goading me yeah I I um I’m not playing these silly games I’m
unsure really I’m just gonna leave it there I’m just gonna leave it there we’re gonna put it out there it’s gonna probably if you like it take it if you
don’t do what you like with it pair of long socks we’ve already started we’ve called in
the teams The Crushers the niblicks the iron heads it’s like who the who the
hell cares if they’re wearing shorts now the game’s gone so far away from where
it was it’s like Jesus yeah I I find it yeah it’s just like
picky battles those you know it’s like you really think for Liv it’s like yeah we might as well
because it’s just a cheap shot isn’t it in a way yeah exactly kind of a fine fair enough one it’s like yeah and you know what we’re also better than PGA
Tour because you can wear shorts here wait and probably all the players are like
you know what it’s not a game changer for me actually the fact that I can’t wear shorts on the PGA tour isn’t going
to be enough of an incentive to push me over to live but who knows that’s just my take but
it’s only a matter of time before like Greg Norman does a like a focus group that with a bunch of random golf or a
bunch of random non-golfers where they’re like how do we get people into the game and half the focus could come back we’re like oh well Brooke’s cab
because it’s pretty jacked it’d be quite good to see him playing topless he’s like that’s a great idea
that would be good I would watch that actually Pat Perez less so
could you imagine that press playing topless and on that bombshell until next time thank you very much for tuning in